Nice and thoughtful of Groundspeak....
Nik - KOTM
2010-05-21 06:41:57
a bit I have cut and pasted from their site...
Please Don't Move the Letterboxing Stamps
Our letterboxing friends have asked us to remind everyone that letterboxing stamps are not trade items. So, if you find a letterbox stamp in a geocache, please leave it in the geocache. These intricate stamps are personal property and they are a crucial part of letterboxing. The stamps are not meant for trade and they should not be moved. Thank you.
Who puts a stamp in a geocaching box?
I suspect its bit of
" I'm out geo cacheing and I found a box, not quite where I expected it, but very close, so it must be the cache, even tho it has no geo cache label, it has a log book and a nice little trinket, so I'll assume it the box I'm looking for , write my name in log and trade trinkets, replace box and off I go"
and allegedly there are a few combination letterbox/ geo cache boxes out there. Were I to set one of those I'd be tempted to chain the stamp to the inner box somehow.
Gemma
2010-05-21 19:08:32
Please Don't Move the Letterboxing Stamps
Our letterboxing friends have asked us to remind everyone that letterboxing stamps are not trade items. So, if you find a letterbox stamp in a geocache, please leave it in the geocache. These intricate stamps are personal property and they are a crucial part of letterboxing. The stamps are not meant for trade and they should not be moved. Thank you.
Who puts a stamp in a geocaching box?
Bless them!! :) :) :)
The Wandering Artist
2010-05-21 20:04:18
Puts a new slant on who may be the letterbox thief!
Recently came across a Geo - first impression was that some poor old granny had been robbed of her 'trinkets' to fill the box - then thought maybe someone had another idea as to get rid of all those things you get in cheap Christmas crackers!
Certainly sure I would not walk 2.5 hours to get such a thing!
No, I did not 'steal' any of its contents, and left it in a better condition than what it was found.
Enjoy Dartmoor, whatever you do.
TWA
Dilton Martian
2010-05-22 09:05:34
This reminds me of an e-mail I received recently. Please forgive me for quoting it in full.
Our cache's details can be seen at www.geocaching.com ref GC24E6F. The finder's log entry says-
"Very nice spot quick find. There were two separate caches here, the one that is supposed to be here (BOR#21) and a totally different cache with a logbook. The second cache was out in the open about 4 feet from the other one, so we put them back together. We signed both, but have been unable to find anything out about the second cache, so we can't log it. Maybe it's a cache not listed on geocaching.com, or a cache that has been archived or lost? Can anyone help? "
We notice that you'd originally hidden your box under bricks but it seems someone has recently collected all the bricks in the area to make a surround for a campfire which is probably why it has become exposed. The 2 boxes are currently hidden together in the same tree; yours under a piece of wood and ours next to it in its camouflaged bag. We will update our site's web entry to mention that your box is there to avoid future confusion. Would you like us to place it inside the camo bag with ours thus allowing both sets of "hunters" to experience each others hobby? If you wish to relocate the box go over the bridge and at the campfire follow the "cachers path" to the tree on the right.
We live locally so if there is anything we can do to help let us know
I know geocachers sometimes come in for a lot stick from letterboxers and
DM
The Wandering Artist
2010-05-22 20:02:25
Hi DM
Thanks for your post - read it with interest and especially from the others point of view.
As I said - enjoy Dartmoor (whatever you do)
TWA
Gemma
2010-05-23 19:39:57
Thanks for your post - read it with interest and especially from the others point of view.
As I said - enjoy Dartmoor (whatever you do)
TWA
Not sure that all GC are so understanding
The Wandering Artist
2010-05-23 20:47:38
Gemma
Neither am I, and I have not said so . No one on the GC group is going to commit themselves on behalf of others. At the end of the day anyone would hope that sense and reasoning will prevail and all can get on with what they like best.
In Meerkat talk = each to their own
twa
Nik - KOTM
2010-05-31 08:14:23
Makes me wonder if some of the Cache boxes are "following" the letterbox code with none sited in man made objects on the moor?
I hope so
Gemma
2010-05-31 19:32:59
I hope so
I hope so also but they are NOT.... seems that the Dartmoor code does not spell it out :(
Nik - KOTM
2010-06-01 17:28:08
might be worth dropping a line to the necessary peeps
Gemma
2010-06-04 06:49:32
Chocolate tea pot springs to mind!!! :D
From what I have read on the forums is that most of the fatuity will huff & puff and do there very best to prove that there is no need for THEM to comply with any rules. So of the folk question why Landowners have the right to refuse them permission.. Lots of the containers do not have any permission.
Hay why should I give a..............
Brinnie
2010-06-08 12:16:14
I am a letterboxer and a cacher, unfortunately geocaching has gone down hill since I started in 2004, it used to be more or less like letterboxing and the caches could be visited as you are letterboxing.
In the last few years geocaching has grown massively, probably because it is easier to get the cache clues than letterbox clues. The problem is the people who put out the caches seem to think they can put them where they like, such as farmer’s hedges, man-made structures on Dartmoor. The geocaching organisation used to stick to the letterboxing rules, and in the early days all worked well. Then with the glut of new cachers they started putting caches in man-made stone work.
The local reviewer (who lives in South Wales,) uses a map called http://www.magic.gov.uk/website/magic/ if, where the cache has been placed is clear of SSSI’s and marked monuments, the cache is allowed, but what he didn’t account for is that there is (according to the DNPA) 19,000 sites of Archaeological Interest on Dartmoor and most of them not marked on the magic map, this has lead to geocaches being placed in such places as:
The wall around Brentor Church, Meldon Kiln, Deancombe Farm, Leather Tor Bridge, plus others, all were in the stonework, all these caches have been removed.
The geocache reviewer will not allow caches in SSSI’s which covers most of Dartmoor, which is sad for those of us who like walking on the upper reaches of the moor.
All the existing caches have been allowed to stay on the moor but in time they will be removed and not replaced.
I had several geocaches out on the moor but have removed them due to the present policies of the “local” reviewer. I am now putting out caches with another caching organisation Opencaching.org.uk Open cachers keep to the letterboxing guides lines which means caches can go out on Dartmoor where ever letterboxes are hidden.
It is a mystery to us all why geocaching.com have given themselves a self imposed ban on a large area of Dartmoor. Far better if they spent their time checking if caches have been placed in a farmers hedge, I wonder how many geocachers know how to repair a hole on a hedge after 50 or so people have pulled away all the vegetation and stones looking for a cache?
As for cache setters being told to ask for permission to place their cache, it seems very odd that some cachers are targeted
as I mentioned before farmers hedges just because they are on the side of a road or even a public footpath seems to be a free for all, (I wonder what the farmer would say about that?) And what about all these magnetic containers on the back of road signs, I don’t suppose anyone asks the Devon County Council if they can be placed there.
Sorry about the moan, but you wouldn’t believe some of the daft places I have found a geocache.
Gemma
2010-06-08 16:29:57
In the last few years geocaching has grown massively, probably because it is easier to get the cache clues than letterbox clues. The problem is the people who put out the caches seem to think they can put them where they like, such as farmer’s hedges, man-made structures on Dartmoor. The geocaching organisation used to stick to the letterboxing rules, and in the early days all worked well. Then with the glut of new cachers they started putting caches in man-made stone work.
The local reviewer (who lives in South Wales,) uses a map called http://www.magic.gov.uk/website/magic/ if, where the cache has been placed is clear of SSSI’s and marked monuments, the cache is allowed, but what he didn’t account for is that there is (according to the DNPA) 19,000 sites of Archaeological Interest on Dartmoor and most of them not marked on the magic map, this has lead to geocaches being placed in such places as:
The wall around Brentor Church, Meldon Kiln, Deancombe Farm, Leather Tor Bridge, plus others, all were in the stonework, all these caches have been removed.
The geocache reviewer will not allow caches in SSSI’s which covers most of Dartmoor, which is sad for those of us who like walking on the upper reaches of the moor.
All the existing caches have been allowed to stay on the moor but in time they will be removed and not replaced.
I had several geocaches out on the moor but have removed them due to the present policies of the “local” reviewer. I am now putting out caches with another caching organisation Opencaching.org.uk Open cachers keep to the letterboxing guides lines which means caches can go out on Dartmoor where ever letterboxes are hidden.
It is a mystery to us all why geocaching.com have given themselves a self imposed ban on a large area of Dartmoor. Far better if they spent their time checking if caches have been placed in a farmers hedge, I wonder how many geocachers know how to repair a hole on a hedge after 50 or so people have pulled away all the vegetation and stones looking for a cache?
As for cache setters being told to ask for permission to place their cache, it seems very odd that some cachers are targeted
as I mentioned before farmers hedges just because they are on the side of a road or even a public footpath seems to be a free for all, (I wonder what the farmer would say about that?) And what about all these magnetic containers on the back of road signs, I don’t suppose anyone asks the Devon County Council if they can be placed there.
Sorry about the moan, but you wouldn’t believe some of the daft places I have found a geocache.
Agree with most of this post but I am not aware that there is a ban on SSSI's. As long as there is permission caches are allowed by the reviwer to be placed on SSSI's. There are many across the UK. The matter of magnetics etc being placed on "street Furnature" is one of my soap box moanes.
Brinnie
2010-06-08 16:54:23
They maintain there is no ban on SSSI’s but getting permission from the DNPA/ Natural England is a pain, from what I gather from Dartmoor cachers, it takes ages even if they get a reply.
Just imagine, put yourself in the shoes of the DNPA they have said they do not mind caches or letterboxes in SSSI’s so why does the geocaching organisation keep emailing them to ask permission?
It is just wasting their time. Some cachers have just given up trying, and put their caches in open caching.
The Wandering Artist
2010-06-08 20:11:48
365 sq mls of Dartmoor to put a GC, not counting in roads trachs etc and someone is saying they need permission to put out a cache!
In all the years of letterboxing I do not recall any letterbox being sited at fault. What have GC' s got lacking? - sorry no prize for the best answer!
TWA.
Brinnie
2010-06-08 20:51:50
I think the problem has accrued because the reviewer lives away from Dartmoor and does not know the area; they need a local reviewer who knows Dartmoor.
Geocaches could be approved/disapproved on local knowledge, not from a layered map which does not show every tinner’s hut, kist or cairn etc.
Dartmoor is unique because of letterboxing, geocaching does not take this into consideration.
It would also help if the reviewer reads the cache details before pressing the approve button, as some caches do not fall in line with guidelines when reading the text!
For example new cache just approved tonight says: “behind the loose stone in the wall”
Need I say anymore!
Gemma
2010-06-10 15:59:34
Just imagine, put yourself in the shoes of the DNPA they have said they do not mind caches or letterboxes in SSSI’s so why does the geocaching organisation keep emailing them to ask permission?
It is just wasting their time. Some cachers have just given up trying, and put their caches in open caching.
Agree why keep asking for proof,-- A**e covering mode!!
The Wandering Artist
2010-06-10 19:58:04
Having read all the posts I am at a loss to understand the basic problem.
If the GC`s put something in a pot (or other container) and abide by the same rules / Code of Practice as that abided by Letterboxers and which has been accepted by the DNPA for so long (!) I do not see there being a need to have approval. Maybe I am missing a point?
Letterboxing , to me is unique to Dartmoor and therefore any GC`ing that takes place should be governed by the same 'rules', and not what may take place 'wherever'
TWA
Brinnie
2010-06-10 20:40:36
The geocaching rules say all caches worldwide should be reviewed before going live on the website, which is fine as long as it is done properly talking local circumstances into consideration. Unfortunately the quality of the reviewing is questionable, when caches are being placed in archaeological places of interest on Dartmoor.
Gemma
2010-06-11 08:51:51
Sloping shoulders management!!
The Wandering Artist
2010-06-11 20:01:42
Since GC is 'Worldwide' - to cut out the hassle etc. I suggest they - the GC`s leave Dartmoor to the letterboxers - is there not enough room `Worldwide' for you!
`simple'
TWA
Nik - KOTM
2010-06-12 08:42:31
Just imagine, put yourself in the shoes of the DNPA they have said they do not mind caches or letterboxes in SSSI’s so why does the geocaching organisation keep emailing them to ask permission?
It is just wasting their time. Some cachers have just given up trying, and put their caches in open caching.
This goes back to the 1990's when there were around 20000 boxes out on the moor and the DPA decided there was a need to cut back on boxes this was done over a period of 5 years allowing people to claim their property, otherwise this was looked at litter which technically it is.
Not that I have anything against geocaching but left unchecked it would spread across the moor like a plague. Whereas a lot of boxers respect the moor I do know of many townies who geocache and have no or little respect for their "art". You cannot put out a charity walk anymore without permission from the DPA and left unchecked Geocaching would swamp boxing which would lead to both activities being banned from the moor IMO and as a letterboxer I certainly wouldn't want that. There are a few letterboxers out there who I believe are irresponsible and don't care too, so it goes both ways.
Having said that - if I were to find a cache box or a letterbox in the wrong place I would remove it and try to contact the owners for its return
Brinnie
2010-06-12 12:36:25
Geocaching rules say no cache can be nearer than 326ft to another cache; the reviewer will not publish a cache which is too close. This sounds a bit daft on Dartmoor but this is a worldwide rule more suited to town parks and such like to stop a cache being placed under every bush.
Sometimes I think this would be a good idea for letterboxing but impossible to police!
I have moved cache containers taken photos and sent them to the reviewer and asked him why he has approved such a cache. I get a whole lot of silly accuses back! If you do move a cache, you should email the owner, who is listed on the cache page, a while back a letterboxer went onto the geocaching forum to complain about a cache being in an unsuitable place, and the caches where really rude to him, no one should have to put up with that.
Dartymoor
2011-11-06 21:41:27
Sorry to bump an old thread, but the situation has changed quite a bit and other googlers may benefit from fresh info.
GAGB have a database of geocache agreements from various landowners. This include DNP who have approved Geocaches on most areas of the moor but ask that they follow the Letterbox Code (something they support). In that, any caches in old walls, dangerous places etc should not be allowed, but I know geocaches on Dartmoor today are plentiful and varied!
There are a few specific areas excluded such as Roos Tor, Whitchurch Common and Spitchwick for good reasons. (The db also includes the letters from the landowners giving their reasons which is sometimes a good read!)
http://www.gagb.co.uk/gagb/glad/index.php
Tamerton Chocolates
2011-11-07 08:59:25
And also - the aforementioned MAGIC map (which is compiled by DEFRA I think and is actually very interesting) does include all scheduled monuments (i.e. stone circles, kistvaens, tinners huts etc)
This is i think the link they use: http://benchmarks.org.uk/magicmapit.php